Re: [Leica] Value Placed on Work

[Ted Grant <tedgrant@islandnet.com>]

Jim Brick wrote:

>In my old age, I look at things a little differently. In one's youth, one
>is eager to show people what you do and how well you do it. And the
>mentality of "what am I worth" isn't there.
>
>As you get older, and wiser, it starts to sink in. The previous posts,
>citing comebacks like "do you get paid a wage?" or "is the cake free?" are
>good. But just a start.

Hi Jim,

How true, when you're younger you can't get the pictures out fast enough to
show "how good you are and I'll work for you for food, cause I love taking
pictures!"

Then as you become mature? older? certainly wiser, you find that "food
isn't everything" And that the more you charge the better you are
"supposed" to be.

I starts to sink in when you hear the fees other photographers charge. A
friend of mine who shoots magnificent "annual reports with a
photojournalist available light style" told me what he charged.  I just
about fell off the chair and asked, "John what the hell do you do that I
don't to warrant that kind of fee?"

His response? " I try not to feel guilty when I give them the invoice!" And
he smiled broadly!  It hadn't occurred to me to even imagine asking the
kind of fee he was asking, let alone getting it.

He also said , "you're only as good as the amount of your day rate!"  The
higher the better, companies are prepared to "buy the high chargers because
the more they charge the better they are supposed to be!"  We know that
isn't true!

As there are fast talking photographers who charge amazing amounts for
their garbage, oops, sorry their work and get away with it because they are
fast talkers.  Then there are those photographers who do a very fine shoot
but, can't sell ice cream on a 100 degree day in LA! They can't sell
themselves worth a damn.

I agree with you completely, the higher the price the better your chances
are for lots of work! I ask young photographers, "which would you rather
do? Work your butt off for five days at $1000.00 a day to make $5000,  or
one day at $5000.00? Then use the other four days to lay on the beach and
relax?:)

Usually they opt for the $5000.00 a day, while saying, "I'll never get that
kind of money ever!"  My response?  "Nope, not unless you ask for it!" Then
they think about it, their eyes light up and they smile. And to my good
feelings, I've had a couple of the really good ones tell me a few years
later, "Remember that day you told us about $5000.00 a day and asking? Well
it works, you just have to have the guts to ask it the first time!"

The other side of the coin is, it's much easier to start high and come
down, than start low then try to increase the rate, no matter who the
photographer is.

I still have a hard time relating to selling a print for $500 to $1000
dollars. Why?  Heck It's only a piece of photographic paper! :) Now you
know I'm a lousy business man and a poor photographer. :)  Gee, that
doesn't sound right! OK, I'm a lousy business man, but an OK photographer.:)

Jim Brick:
>My point is, you are only worth, the worth that you place on your work. And
>people seem to equate price with quality. If you hang a framed 20x24 for
>$250, and a very similar 20x24 for $950, the $250 photograph can even be
>better, but the $950 photograph will usually sell first.>>>>>>>

Boy is that ever true!  Thank goodness I have Sandy Carter as my assistant
and associate, at least there is one around here with brains for charging
the right amounts. Actually she makes me choke sometimes at what she tells
clients the rate for a project is. Then to my surprise the next thing I
know we are off and running on something or other.:)

One thing that has been very important for me, is the "other person selling
me rather than myself."  Some photographers can sell themselves like honey
to bees, not me, hell I'm as shy as all get out when I'm asked to show my
"portfolio."  It's kind of "look here is my work gee whiz I hope you like
it and please give me the assignment."

C'mon, I've only been published since September 1950 and I'm a shy kinda
guy when it comes to showing my work to folks in case they don't like it.
:)  But an agent or associate who walks in, puts it on the table as though
I walk on water with a camera with very interesting fees, makes all the
difference in the world.

Jim Brick:
>You should NEVER EVER sell yourself short.>>>>>>

Biggest mistake made by photographers. Usually they are more interested in
taking pictures than how much they money they make from it! Unfortunately,
by the time they learn otherwise, it's usually too late to recover the
financial losses.

jim Brick:
>As some already said, they now have requests from all kinds of people, for
>kid pictures. You are in a situation where you cannot photograph any of
>these peoples kids. They know what your work is worth. It's worth a 25
>sheet package of paper. And if you charge them more, they will resent you
>forever.

They will do that and some with a vengeance! It may seem like a small thing
at the time,  "a package of paper, how nice of them."  Then you decide time
to charge something, "surprise!"    "Hey I thought you didn't charge and
I've bought you a couple of rolls of film cause....." etc! etc!  And now
you're in deep doo doo!

Most non-photographic people have absolutely no idea what it entails to be
involved in photography as a hobby or profession. They think it's
click-click, local 1 hour and here's your snaps!

":You mean you get paid that amount of money just to go "click!"  Man I'm
going to get into that racket!"

So as Jim says, " don't EVER sell yourself short!">>>>>

>Once you sell yourself short, you will have to change your name and have
>plastic surgery, in order to, once again, get proper recognition.>>>>>

Jim you forgot..."and move to another country!"

This may not be pure Leica related conversation, but hopefully it'll save
some of you folks a hard time from those expecting freebie picture taking.
Maybe make you see the value of your pictures in order to earn a few
dollars for new Leica gear.:) Now that got it nicely on track.:)
ted

Ted Grant
This is Our Work. The Legacy of Sir William Osler.
http://www.islandnet.com/~tedgrant