Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2007/11/13
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]Fascinating to read the accurateness of the measurements. It is almost incredible to believe that these tiny variations would make such a difference. Erwin is a real apostle :-) But at some stage, I was thinking he was talking of this camera: <http://home.earthlink.net/~dannygoodwin/22.html> or was it this one? <http://warandgame.wordpress.com/2007/11/08/hythe-gun-camera/> Philippe Op 13-nov-07, om 20:36 heeft Thinkofcole@aol.com het volgende geschreven: > > from Erwin Puts _http://www.imx.nl/photo/faq/_ > (http://www.imx.nl/photo/faq/) > I hope this helps, G. Medina...(Hexar is listed under Leica).... > regards, > bob cole > > > Konica Hexar and register > > > I am currently using the Hexar RF for several reasons. To test the > new > Hexanon 2/35mm, to check on Hexar body - Leica lens compatibility > and get a > feeling for the Hexar system. > > To start with the body: the specs are well known, so I can jump to > the more > philosophical topics. The body appears to be a very high > engineering quality, > has a very solid feeling and is really easy to use. The electronic > shutter-motordrive unit is a sealed box and can not be separated. > It is the same as > used in the Contax G/2 series. As an aside: if Leica were to use > this unit, the > manual advance lever would have to go. The viewfinder is slightly > lower in > contrast than the Leica and the Hexar rangefinder patch has a > distinct yellow > tint, that will lower contrast and makes it more difficult to > focus at > objects at 10 meter or more distance. While the body has almost > identical > dimensions to the Leica, the look and feel is distinctly > different. The rounded body > contours of the Leica and the clean top cover make it look more > elegant, > compared to the squarish and somewhat boxy character of the Hexar. > > In use the Hexar is quite simple and its controls are well laid > out and > generally useful to the photographer. The exposure compensation > feature is nice, > but with the leica a simple half click stop of the aperture ring > will do the > job as fast and easy. > > Biggest drawback of the hexar is the small time delay between > pressing the > shutterknob and the actual firing of the shutter. This delay and > the instant > of wait and thus insecurity is most annoying and you can not use > the Leica > technique of prefocusing and fire when the object is sharp in the > finderpatch. > > When you close your eyes and pick up the Leica and the Hexar > several times, > the difference in feeling and haptics emerges. When you hold the > Leica, your > thumb slides behind the advance lever and your finger lays on the > shutter > release button, which is sharp as a trigger. This simple and > intuitive act > signifies to the brain a state of alert attention and you fall > into the mood of a > hunter or an active sportsperson anticipating the moves of the > other players. > > When holding the Hexar, both hands hold the body and wen your > finger touches > the release button, there is no trigger effect. The finger just > rests there > and you do not get any feedback from the body. So you switch almost > automatically into a more passive state of mind and allow the > camera to work for you. > That is easy to do as the automatic functions of the camera > (exposure, film > transport, motorwinder) are so well executed that you start to > rely on them > and even transfer control to them. In fact you are starting to > become an > operator of the camera, adjusting the wheels and not the driver > who forces the > camera to do as he wants it to act. > > The transfer of controls to the camera and the mood of becoming > more passive > in the photographic act is in my view the fine distinction between > the Hexar > and the Leica. Photographing the same objects with a leica and a > Hexar in > quick succession underscores this difference: with the Leica the > work is harder > (more to think and act), but your act blends in with the subject > and you are > part of it. With the Hexar your work is easier, but the remoteness > of the > controls acts as a filter between the object and yourself. Let me > say, that you > become a bit lazier when using the hexar and that shows in the > pictures. > > Technically there is nothing wrong with the Hexar pictures, well > exposed, > sharply focused etc. The Hexar then is for photographers who avoid > technicalities and want good imagery with a minimum of technical > and manual control and > who feel that the visual involvement with the object has to be > separated, even > detached from the tool they use. In this sense the Hexar is close > to the > Contax G. The family resemblance goes a step farther. My test of > the Hexanon > 2/35 indicates that Hexanon imagery is in character very close to > the Zeiss > philosphy of correction. The Hexanon is an 8 element lens (with > the now familiar > negatively curved front lens, pioneered by Leica and quickly > adopted by > Konica and Voigtlander). The Summicron has 7 elements, but has one > aspherical > surface, and one such a surface equals two spherical surfaces). At > full aperture > the lens exhibits a medium contrast (less than the leica lens), > has visible > flare in the bright areas and small detail rendition. The > performance on axis > till an image height of 6mm (image circle of 12 mm diameter) is > excellent > with a very good definition of very small detail. In the outer > zones the image > quality drops significantly and now we see small detail with quite > blurred > edges. Astigmatism is very well controlled, but there is some > curvature of > field. The lateral chromatic error is quite large, and may add in > the bokeh > preservation. The corners are very weak. At 2.8 the flare is gone > and the image > crispens a bit, the central disk of excellent quality now extends > to a image > height of 8 mm, with the corners still bad and the outer zones > hardly improving. > At 4 we find an overall improvement, but the chromatic error still > softens > the edges of very small and tiny detail. At this aperture the > quality is > comparable to the Leica, that shows better reduction of the > chromatic error and > thus a crisper and cleaner image. If resolution figures were > relevant, I had to > note that the > Konica has the edge here. But these are bench mark figures (large > scale > projection test) and in actual photography the small advantage > would be lost. > This sideline indicates that differences in resolution of 10 line > pairs/mm are > not indicative of superior image quality. Optimum aperture is at > 8, and after > that contrast and resolution drop due to diffraction effects. > Close up > performance at 1 meter is identical to the tested distance which > is at 100 times > the focal length. > > The inevitable question of course is how this Hexar lens compares > to the > last non aspherical Summicron. In my view the Hexanon is the > better lens > overall. > > But you cannot use the Hexanon lens on a Leica body: a collimator > check > showed that the Hexanon lens has a focus plane that differs from > the Leica lens > by 0.09mm. Is that important? The discussion on the Lug about the > Hexar > body/Leica lens compatibility dismissed small differenes in the > area of less that > half a mm as irrelevant, because some uses could not detect any > difference > when comparing different lens/body combinations. The truth is > this: a did a test > on the bench and focussed carefully on maximum image quality. Then > I used a > micrometer to defocus by 0.03mm (which is quite small). In the > image the loss > of contrast was very evident, but resolution at least at the lower > frequencies (around 40 lp/mm) did not suffer. What did suffer was > the edge sharpness. > If you were to do your own testing and looking at the negatives > with an > 8-times magnifier, you would not se any drop in resolution (beyond > the detection > capability of the eye at that magnification). But at a larger > magnification > you begin to see it quite > clearly. > > Now the continuing saga of the Hexar/Leica lens compatibility. > First a few > remarks: You can not measure the actual distance from bayonet > flange to > pressure plate by using the pressure plate itself as a reference. > The slightest and > unnoted pressure from the instrument itself on the pressure plate > will give > errors and the pressure plate itself is hardly ever a plane > itself. So > additional errors. The only way to do it is to remove the pressure > plate and insert > a device that is calibrated to be at the same distance where the > pressure > plate ideally has to be. To start from here. The distance from the > bayonet > flange to the pressure plate or more accurate the top of the outer > film guide > rails ( pressure plate rails) in the Leica M is 27.95mm. This > distance is also > (but wrongly referred to as register. But this distance and > measurement is > used to check if the guide rails and the bayonet flange are > parallel to each > other > and have the correct distance. The second important measure is the > distance > from the film rail (the innermost film guide rails) to the bayonet > flange. In > the Leica this is 27.75mm. The film gate then has a distance of > 0.2mm. In > every Leica book I know of there is a reference to the filmplane/ > flange of > 27.80mm. > > What is this. Rogliatti, Roger Hicks, Collectors Checklist, > Hasbrouck you > name them, all refer to flange to film plane distance or flange to > film > register. Now in German the word is "Auflagemass". This can be > correctly translated > as "flange focal length" or "flange focal distance". But this > measurement is > done for the lens itself on a collimator where the lens is > adjusted such that > the distance from the lens bayonet flange to the true optical > focal plane > (focal point) is indeed exact 27.80mm. First lesson: NEVER believe > what is > written about Leica in books that are focussed on history or > collecting: these > persons are no engineers. In every other book, check, double check, > triple > check to make sure the person knows what he talking about. > > To sum up: we have an optical measurement done on the lens to > adjust the > flange focal distance and that distance should be 27.80mm. We have > a mechanical > measurement on the Leica body, which is the distance from bayonet > flange and > the pressure plate rails which is 27.95mm. The film gate is 0.2mm. > If we now > use a film with a total thickness (emulsion plus base) of 0.13mm > (APX25 as > example) the thickness of the film will not fit into the film > gate. There is > some play and therefore the film will curl and curve inwardly > (away from the > lens). By using a focal distance of 27.80mm, Leica will ensure > that the film > when bowed a little, still will be correctly aligned in relation > to the focal > plane. It is intriguing to note that thick colour neg films of > about 0.27mm > will fill the > film gate completely and the pressure plate will press the film to > a plane > position, instead of the curved position with thin film emulsions. > Theoretically a thick film would have a better flatness than a > thin film. Of course more > research is needed, but these investigations do show that the > information in > the public domain is at best scanty or at worst misleading. > > Now for the Konica Hexar. Here I have only one official fact: that > is the > bayonet flange to the pressure plate rails of 28.00mm. But I do > not have > official info about the flange distance to the film rails (or film > gate distance). > Nor about the lens flange focal length. My own measurements on one > Hexar body > and lens showed that the film gate had a thickness of .24mm and > the lens a > flange focal length distance of 27.71. On the basis of these > measurements the > flange to film rail distance is 27.76mm. These results are however no > reliable enough to draw firm conclusions. What I do know from > discussions with > konica people is that their tolerances are wider than with leica > and are choosen > such that the best fit of Hexar body to hexar lenses is assured. > The many > inconclusive reports about problems or the lack of problems with > fitting a leica > lens on a Hexar body is partly to be explained by these tolerances > and partly > by the unreliability of the reports themselves. The Konica people > at the > factory told me that the Hexar is designed for use with the > Hexanon lenses and t > hat all dimensions inside the Hexar are based on that fact. If a > hexar user > fits a leica lens and he has problems, than it is caused by these > different > dimensions and/or the chain of tolerances add up unfavorably. If > he has no > problems: than he is plain lucky as the tolerances are such that > they are close > to what is expected for leica bodies and/or his demands are such > that they are > below the visibility threshold for the mismatch to show up. > > This is not the end of the story. People would expect quick > solutions and > fast answers and move on to the next topic. That is living in the > fast and > superficial lane of user group discussions. Serious research takes > time and > experience and dedication: scarce resources in a hasty world. > > > > ************************************** See what's new at http:// > www.aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >