Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2013/11/07

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Subject: [Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7
From: steve.barbour at gmail.com (Steve Barbour)
Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2013 19:56:52 -0800
References: <8D0A94521E6344B-CE8-80D9@webmail-d187.sysops.aol.com> <CAJ3Pgh7yAwR+c4gh2A=Jh0JQ+Xb2cDs7prx2WDNYzqZ3o9DyzA@mail.gmail.com> <DA935AF3-BF05-4762-B66B-99685DE67A7A@icloud.com> <732CF4DE-4CDD-43E0-9ED8-BD9080A23E2C@gmail.com> <08F12213-F771-4996-A65D-9F31F6284B67@icloud.com> <03ae01cedb7b$90d52070$b27f6150$@verizon.net> <CAE3QcF6PP2yfhkYcVLPpDJQfoPZnWjsnV_0u35zRC+3Yy2xbgg@mail.gmail.com> <CAJ3Pgh4VsWgAKBwSEm70BstVv4RueJwkYOH-UDoGvPAxJOoMpw@mail.gmail.com>

Steve Barbour


steve.barbour at gmail.com


On Nov 7, 2013, at 9:11 AM, Paul Roark <roark.paul at gmail.com> wrote:

>> ... You are by definition losing quality in those corners ...
> 
> The a7r does have inward looking micro lenses.  How they compare to the M9
> or M (which use different angles on them) will need tests to answer.  On
> the electronic side of the lens mount, however, I do not dismiss Sony.
> 
> At this point, I don't see enough information in tests to tell whether the
> Sony a7r (different than the plain a7) microlenses are better or worse than
> Leica's.  For now, I'd call that an open question.
> 
> Assuming there microlenses are competitive, this raises the question for me
> of whether in-camera correction profiles are necessarily better than doing
> it in the computer in post processing.   The corners are always going to be
> darker than the center with any lens; vignetting to some degree is normal.
> However, the corners of wide angle lenses can run into the dynamic range
> limits of the sensor.  That is, the corners get so much darker that they
> are pushed down into unacceptably noisy values.  Making a noisy image
> lighter does not cure the problem.
> 
> With a CCD, I don't see any theory that supports in-camera correction being
> better than post-processing.  Most of the noise if from the sensor site and
> connection between the sensor and the processor.  So for signal to noise
> ratio, it's mostly game over by the time the data reaches the in-camera
> processor.
> 
> With a CMOS, there may be an advantage to in-camera processing.  Where CMOS
> gets its lower noise advantages with higher ISOs is by amplifying the
> signal at the sensor site to reduce the impact of noise that is acquired in
> the transmission of the data to the processor.  However, for a CMOS
> in-camera profile to have an advantage over post-processing, it would seem
> that the camera would need to accomplish the vignetting correction via
> increasing the effective ISO at the pixel site via differential
> amplification.  That is, the pixels would need to have increasing
> amplifications as the pixels get further away from the center.   I doubt
> that the cameras are that sophisticated.  I'm guessing all the corrections
> are made in the camera's processor after the data is offloaded from the
> sensor.  If that is the case, then I doubt in-camera has any advantage over
> post processing aside from convenience.
> 
> Time and better testing is all that is going to answer our questions.  The
> concept of competition in digital bodies that will take our M glass,
> however, is inevitable, and I expect it'll be wonderful news for the high
> end, light weight market segment.  Needless to say, the concept of mating
> the best German optics to the best Japanese electronics intrigues me.

me too Paul, 

and the rest was well stated (I think)  

:-)


Steve



> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
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In reply to: Message from lrzeitlin at aol.com (lrzeitlin at aol.com) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from roark.paul at gmail.com (Paul Roark) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from george.imagist at icloud.com (George Lottermoser) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from steve.barbour at gmail.com (Steve Barbour) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from george.imagist at icloud.com (George Lottermoser) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from red735i at verizon.net (Frank Filippone) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from hopsternew at gmail.com (Geoff Hopkinson) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)
Message from roark.paul at gmail.com (Paul Roark) ([Leica] Leica lenses on Sony A7)