Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 1996/07/16
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]At 08:43 PM 7/15/96 -0700, you wrote: >At 09:10 AM 7/15/96 -0400, you wrote: > >>AND--despite some others' comments--it does matter that the reflexes are way >>behind the times--e.g., since they have old fashioned shutters that won't >>synch fast enough no pro who does weddings or outdoor groups will even look > >Any pro that uses Leica for that purpose is in the wrong business. That is >the domain of MF cameras (and LF for large groups). Weddings, okay, but only >for the candids, and the R7 is just fine with that. It does fill flash. But >I agree, 1/250 (or 1/300 in the new F5) is important. Sorry, but lots of pros do weddings with 35 (though of course MF is better)--and even those who use MF for the formal shots often use 35 for candids and informal group shots as you say. My point's still there--the R7's ability to do fill is still seriously compromised by the slow shutter, and it does matter. >>at the camera. It does matter that Leica won't seriously look at an >>up-to-date M camera (aperture preferred automation, spot and averaging >>metering, and a reasonable film loading system would be easy)--look at the >>success of the Contax G1. Again, my guess is that limited resources are >>partly to blame. > >To this I will disagree. The G1 is getting lots of hoots and hollers over >the major flaws in design. And many, many people have used them, then sold >them. They have great lenses. But they are not functional in any way or sort >compared to an M6. Sure they're great for point and shooting, but not for >pro use. You're right in part--in fact, when the G1 came out I incorrectly predicted failure for it, because it lacks two essential M virtues, super speed lenses and quietness. However, I am in touch with a lot of people who sell Leicas and Contaxes, and the G1 is still, today, way outselling the M6, and is often sold to M6 owners, and is often preferred by them. Why? I think it's because M cameras are often used as travel cameras, and here, in many situations, the G1 would be fine. I, too, have read a couple of notes on the net about people selling G1's, but if this were a general phenomenon, you'd see falling G1 sales and prices, and tons of used ones in *Shutterbug*, and you don't. (By the way, I much prefer the M6, and don't like point and shoots. The point here is not my preference, but that Leica could have easily updated the M so it would be more competitive--as I say, a bit of automation is not a bad thing.) >>The fact that something or other is hard to get for a while doesn't prove >>that sales are great--it only reflects a ratio between supply and demand. >>How many M6 J's were made? > >It doesn't matter. The M6-J was a collector item. What does matter is that >Leica can't make M6s fast enough to meet the demand. And their market >research has told them people don't want them to change the M6's basic >concept. Some improvements would be welcome, and there is a CL2-type camera >coming, maybe soon. But it's not a replacement for the M6, but a competitor >with the G-1 in the less serious market. This misses my point. I was replying to someone who used the M6-J's scarceness to prove that Leicas were in high demand. Substitute "M6" for "M6-J" and the point is still the same--the fact that Leica "can't make M6s fast enough to meet the demand" does not prove that their sales are sufficient to support the upgrading and technical innovation Leica needs to take up--let alone make any money. BTW, I think a CL type camera would be a bad mistake, especially if it is somewhat incompatible with the M system as the old one was. Just continue the M6, and bring out an M7 with autoexposure and more sophisticated metering (to do aperture preferred and spot metering would require no changes to the lenses). Remember how the M sales took off when Leica finally brought out the M6, with the M4's virtues AND TTL metering? Who's to say that wouldn't happen with an M7? >=================== >Eric Welch >Grants Pass (OR) Daily Courier >NPPA Region 11 JIB chair > >Diplomacy: Say nice doggie until you find a *BIG* stick > > Charles E. Love, Jr. 517 Warren Place Ithaca, New York 14850 607-272-7338 CEL14@CORNELL.EDU