Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2003/09/09

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Subject: RE: [Leica] Riefenstahl Dies
From: "bdcolen" <bdcolen@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 14:07:50 -0400

I seriously doubt that you would, Johnny, and I wonder why you would
even hypothetically say such a thing.

And yes indeed there are current parallels.

B. D.

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
[mailto:owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us] On Behalf Of Johnny
Deadman
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 1:11 PM
To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
Subject: Re: [Leica] Riefenstahl Dies


Were we to all be suddenly transported back to pre WWII Germany without 
the benefit of hindsight it is a sobering thought that about half the 
people on this list would be supporters of Hitler (I have no idea how 
many Jewish members this list has but I exempt them from my 
generalization). Maybe I would. Maybe you would.

Maybe we too would have been there at Nuremberg with our Leicas.

Many, many, many decent people supported Hitler. It is a completely 
false idea to imagine that the great masses of Germans opposed Hitler 
but were held in terror by the Gestapo and SS, or that everyone who 
supported Hitler was thereby  a personification of evil.

I watched TRIUMPH OF THE WILL very recently because I am writing about 
this period and I was struck most forcefully by the similarities 
between certain parts of the Nuremberg rallies and contemporary 
political conventions (perhaps not surprising since the rallies were a 
Nazi Party event).

In particular, in his own speeches Hitler stuck to vacuous but 
grand-sounding phrases about homeland, security, the struggle, the 
heroic German army, the fact that it was the greatest country in the 
world, protecting freedom, terrorism etc. He left the nasty stuff about 
the Jews largely to Goebbels.

I strongly recommend anyone who is even mildly interested in this to 
get the DVD and watch it with the subtitles on.

The lasting value of TRIUMPH OF THE WILL, which is a truly astounding 
cinematic achievement whatever its political and moral connotations, 
may be simply that it holds up a mirror to our own times and enables us 
to spot the techniques of demagogery and the traits of megalomania when 
they appear on our TV sets.

On Tuesday, September 9, 2003, at 12:11 PM, bdcolen wrote:

> Oh, I guess you're right. If only the rest of Hitler's inner circle 
> had said that, we could venerate them as artists as well - after all, 
> wouldn't Mengele have qualified as a great creator of crafts for those

> lampshades of his?;-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
> [mailto:owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us] On Behalf Of 
> Saganich, Christopher/Medical Physics
> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 11:54 AM
> To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
> Subject: RE: [Leica] Riefenstahl Dies
>
>
> What exactly would here apology sound like, in order to satisfy you, 
> "I'm sorry for filming the Nazi Rally, and the Olympics."  Weren't we 
> at those games?  Well we all have our ideal versions of history and 
> none of
> it is true anyway, so the argument itself can be considered
propaganda.
>
> Chris Saganich
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bdcolen@earthlink.net [mailto:bdcolen@earthlink.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 11:05 AM
> To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
> Subject: RE: [Leica] Riefenstahl Dies
>
> She was an unapologetic Nazi propagandist - a true believer in 
> Hitler's greatness. Shed not a tear, and be sure there is a very warm 
> spot waiting for her, deep beneath our feet - if one believes in such 
> places or concepts.;-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
> [mailto:owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us] On Behalf Of Phong
> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 8:38 AM
> To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
> Subject: RE: [Leica] Riefenstahl Dies
>
>
> Wasn't she also a Nazi propagandist ?
> Was she used by the Nazis or was she a true believer or something in 
> between ? She, of course, was a noted Leica photographer.
>
> - Phong
>
> NO ARCHIVE
>
> Gerry Walden wrote:
>> A great photographer and movie maker who has suffered her whole life 
>> from supporting her country at the time of war.
>>
>> Gerry
>
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John Brownlow

http://www.pinkheadedbug.com http://www.unintended-consequences.com

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