Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2012/11/06
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]After shooting much digital DSLR'S I've of course went back and shot film now and again with M6's and III'fs and no the expressions on the faces were not all that much better. If at all. Probalby not at all. In a word, No. An advantage digital has over film is coverage. You can cover yourself way better as you can afford to. Its not costing you 20 bucks to get the shot its not costing you 20 cents. Its costing 2. You can not just click a couple and hope for the best but really go to town and shoot the hell out of your subject and go over it with a fine tooth comb and find a shot which really says it.... him or her. Of course that does not stop the countless masses of dilatants on the internet from saying that that very thing is a WEAKNESS of digital. As they could not be bothered. It takes them away from precious eBay trading time. Mark William Rabiner Photography http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ > From: jon streeter <jon.streeter at cox.net> > Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org> > Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 21:12:37 -0800 > To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org> > Subject: Re: [Leica] Marty, shutter lag in digital M > > I will resist the temptation to offer shooting advice to other > photographers > whom I don't know and with whose work I am not familiar. > > I thank Marty for providing really sound, articulate, and useful > information. I certainly appreciate Tina Manley's opinion that she has > not > found the digital Ms to be problematic. I've been a fan of Tina's work for > years. > > On the other hand, some have advised me on how to anticipate action. > Others > have told me shutter lag doesn't really exist. Still others have said it's > a waste of time to discuss shutter lag because it's not important. Imagine > being a traveler asking directions and being given instruction on finding > one's way, but not being given the directions you seek. Imagine being told > the place you seek doesn't exist, though you're certain it does. Imagine > being told you're foolish to go there. Well, I've "been there." I bought > my first camera, a Rolleiflex, when I was fifteen. When I was seventeen, I > bought a Leica M3. At the time, I had only the vaguest idea of how > terrific > these cameras were. I was, however, very serious about making photographs. > If you see the photographs I was taking (jonstreeter.com) when I was a > teenager, I hope you will conclude that I had some understanding of the > craft early on. I was certainly seduced by it. > > I posed my original question here, on the LEICA Users Group, in the hope > that I'd find someone with on-point experience to share. My question is -- > at the risk of repeating myself -- has anyone returned to a Leica film > camera after using DSLRs or digital Ms, shot portraits with it, and thought > the results were somehow better, that you got more hits than with DSLRs or > digital Ms, and then wondering if it's because the reason you're getting > such great facial expressions and gestures and movements might just be > because the Leica M has a shorter shutter lag than the DSLRs? It's pretty > much a yes-or-no question, with embellishments and invitations to delve > further into the subject most welcome. For example, one might say, Yes, > I've noticed that myself, but only between DSLRs and Leicas, and, > therefore, > I have concluded it's not shutter lag but something else, perhaps the way > one perceives things through a rangefinder's viewfinder. Or one might > say, > Yes, in my portrait sessions with the M9, I do get fewer hits than with my > MP. Or one might say, No, I've actually checked this out because I > wondered > the same thing, and I can discern no difference in the results between my > M9 > and my M7. Anybody? Of course, this might work only if one has had > portrait sittings or sessions with the same model done with different > cameras since in that case the main variable would be the camera, not > what's > in front of it. I know some of you have not noticed a problem with > shutter > lag, but since our styles and subject matter and methods may very likely > differ, I have no way to relate another photographer's lack of notice of a > problem with shutter lag to my own situation. > > I would not have written such a lengthy post, but I wanted to make sure my > question was specific and clear. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Meier > Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 1:59 PM > To: Leica Users Group > Subject: Re: [Leica] Marty, shutter lag in digital M > > SLR's that have to autofocus before the shutter goes are not faster than an > M Leica. > > > On Nov 6, 2012, at 2:43 PM, <tedgrant at shaw.ca> wrote: > >> Marty Deveney OFFERED: >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Marty Deveney" <benedenia at gmail.com> >> To: "Leica Users Group" <lug at leica-users.org> >> Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 7:44 PM >> Subject: Re: [Leica] Marty, shutter lag in digital M >> >>>> Now that the digital M >>>> cameras have long shutter-lag times even when compared to DSLRs, >>>> suddenly >>>> we're hearing that shutter lag doesn't matter, that nobody notices it. >>>> Really? Nobody? For capturing fleeting expressions in a portrait >>>> session, nobody has noticed it?<<<<<<<<<<< >> >> Marty Mon ami, >> Absolute truth at this moment of reading your posts on Leica lag! And me >> writing this. >> >> The "lag as you describe" in my 50 plus years of using Leica range >> finders/SLR's quite often several at the same time hanging off my body has >> never ever entered one iota of a mille-second of my thoughts, concerns, >> nor >> that it was even happening." To prove my point good Sir, please look at >> my >> webpage TEDGRANTPHOTO.COM and look at a few mille-second photos of >> "ACTIONS!" That if you even thought about shooting the moment.... "YOU >> WOULD >> MISS IT!" >> >> You see I always figure, as with many other techie things I read on the >> LUG. >> If you don't know anything about it? .......... YOU DON'T HAVE THEM >> HAPPEN! WHY? >> >> Well yer far too busy shooting the action without wasting time slowing >> down >> your own reflexes thinking about them, so this stuff just doesn't happen! >> :-) >> >> Well OK I know I'm being a tad facetious. But, "What you don't know wont >> hurt you!" >> >> "SHOOT IT WITHOUT THINKING!" >> >> The content of the moment is the most important always! And if you are >> twittering your brain about some "lag thing?" YOU WILL MISS THE CONTENT >> MOMENT! May have something to do with my concept!" "DON'T THINK! SHOOT >> IT!" >> >> cheers, >> Dr. ted >> >> >>> >>> The M8, M9 and Monochrom lag time is about 1/13s. To me it's the most >>> substantial problem with all these cameras. It's been discussed here >>> widely before: >>> http://leica-users.org/v43/msg02993.html >>> http://leica-users.org/v44/msg03170.html >>> >>> Leica has stated that the new M (typ 240) has new architecture that >>> makes the camera faster and the shutter feel smoother. The dummy >>> cameras that have been doing the rounds at the trade fairs seem to >>> display at least the latter, while no-one has measured the former. >>> >>> Marty >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Leica Users Group. >>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Leica Users Group. >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Leica Users Group. >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information