Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 1998/01/22

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Re: Moss / Pahlen / top plates
From: "Hans Pahlen" <hans@komvux.skola.mark.se>
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 10:53:01 +0100

I know that some Swedish dealers have exported lots of M-gear to foreign
persons who later on distribute it at the international collectors market.
Now the same dealers are looking for black M-bodies, asking to buy anything
they will encounter in their shops (they offer 50% more than less than a
year ago). As they told me that top plates would be exchanged, we can also
assume that new black top plates can be produced and engraved somewhere
outside the Leica factory. As long as they do it on original black bodies,
using real serial numbers, nothing can be proved wrong. If this "production"
is controlled by someone knowing the collectors market well, it is a nice
money maker. I dont think they will use duplicate serial numbers, unless
they want to produce a fake MP, or if they start to convert chrome bodies.
But then they will undermine their own business, very unlikely.

I think Marvin's info was very interesting, and now I can understand the
sudden interest by certain dealers for my black M:s. Well, I will happily go
on using my old M:s, and maybe in the end these people will sell their top
plates as spare parts. Then I will buy one too, as I like black bodies more
than chrome...

I am interested to see Jun's comment. Would please repost it to the LUG.

/Hans

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Mail: hans.pahlen@mark.komvux.se
URL: http://www.komvux.skola.mark.se/hp635.htm
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- -----Original Message-----
From: Leikon35 <Leikon35@aol.com>
To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us <leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us>
Cc: hans@komvux.skola.mark.se <hans@komvux.skola.mark.se>
Date: den 22 januari 1998 04:50
Subject: [Leica] Re: Moss / Pahlen / top plates


> About 6 years ago, a well known West Coast millionaire & Leica
> collector, asked me to find him a Mint Leica MP & that he would
> pay $10,000 for it.  I laughed and said "Jim, there are no Mint MPs,
> practically all 350 of them went to professionals that put them to
> heavy use."  About a year later at the same Pasadena Convention
> Center Camera Show,  Jim showed up and handed me a Mint black
> MP that he had recently purchased.  I examined it very carefully
> & concurred with him that it indeed had all the attributes of being
> authentic.  When I returned home & looked up the s/n of that black
> MP - I found that it had been manufactured in chrome, not black.
>
> Even today I am still puzzled by that anomaly.
>
> Marvin
>======================================================
>In a message dated 98-01-21 06:19:41 EST, you write:
><< Of course they were all Russian copies, but someone
> obviously has started producing top plates for these Zorkys and FEDs.
These
> cameras were fakes, and they made me laugh, but what do we say about all
> these "mint" black M-bodies, that sooner or later will turn up at
different
> auctions? I will stubbornly refuse to sell my M4 to these people. I will
go
> on using >>
>