Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2000/11/29

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Subject: RE: [Leica] Country of origin
From: Peterson Arthur G NSSC <PetersonAG@NAVSEA.NAVY.MIL>
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 13:41:54 -0500

Thank you, Erwin.  As always, gratitude is due!

Art Peterson


- -----Original Message-----
From:	Erwin Puts [mailto:imxputs@knoware.nl]
Sent:	Wednesday, November 29, 2000 1:27 PM
To:	L U G
Subject:	[Leica] Country of origin

The current discussion about the country of origin of the M6 and the
additional value this information might have for the consumer, that is
user/buyer of the camera, can be approached from different perspectives.
I fully agree with Ted and others who argue that the CoO is irrelevant for
the process of taking photographs. If the camera functions as specified and
delivers the goods, what extra info can be gleaned from the fact that the
camera is made in Portugal, Solms or Dresden? Nothing at all. THis is the
same as the obsession with the manufacturer of the glass, that is used in
Leica lenses. Is a Leica lens less worth when it has glass. manufactured by
Hoya (Japan), Corning (France) or Schott (Germany). And who is aware of the
fact  that many glass types from Schott are manufactured in Malaysia?
Is it then in the interest of the general consumer to know the CoO of every
part and the locations of the assembly and quality control? It would only
matter if you can claim that the origin of manufacture and/or assembly has a
statistically relevant impact on qulaity and quality assurance.
Bill has listed the origin of some of the parts and some of the assembly
locations. More could be added and presented in more detail.  But it is
indeed irrelevant. The consumer buys a product and pays for the quality. If
the shutter gears, according to original Solms specs should be made of
material X and be machined to a tolerance of a thousands of an inch and
checked to ensure it has these values, why should it be deemed important
where that check is done and who produces the steel for the gear? Most
socalled Swedish steel, used by Volvo and Saab (and in their advertising!),
is made in Holland at the Hoogovens plant in IJmuiden!
If one would dare to  presume that German workers generally do better than
their Portuguese collegues, I would challenge anyone to prove it or be
accused of xenophobia!
Knowing the meticulous quality and great pride of the Portuguese workers at
the Leica plant, I would sense it as very insulting that someone could
assume that these men mand women would be inferior to the mythical German
quality workers. And if fact: IT IS NOT TRUE!!!!!!
Portuguese quality is as good, if not better than German quality.
To answer the original  question: who would benefit from the knowledge of
the country of origin? It is the dealer of second hand cameras. If one could
say with certainty: Leica M6 cameras till serial number 1.234.567are Solms
made and after that production shifted to Portugal, I am sure that in an
instant those cameras with <#1.234.567 would be priced at a premium by any
dealer as being of higher value.
Just as has happened with M3 bodies with serial number above 1.100.000, that
are assumed to be the pinacle of mechanical Leica quality. I have NEVER read
any serious analysis, why this should be true and after numerous visits to
the factory, where  this question has been discussed in extenso, I still do
not know, nor does the factory itself. This is a myth that will benefit only
two parties: collectors and sellers.
And so does the info about the origin of production, (As Bill as
exemplified: a very vague concept in itself) of M6 bodies. The myth of any
superiority of production origin suits the seller and collector, not the
user. It might be useful to know the origin of a product if we know for sure
that there is a quality difference. But in the case of Portugal versus Solms
or Wetzlar, this difference does not exist and I challenge everyone to bring
conclusive proof of the contrary! Is it then in the interest of the consumer
to know the origin. From a view of playing games like Trival Pursuit: by all
means. From a consumer/user/buyer perspective: not relevant at all.
The "Made in ..." has an interesting origin. In the Industrial Age (around
1870) British products were superior to anything made elsewhere. So when the
Germans started to manufacture industrial goods, the English forced them to
indicate the "made in germany" on their products as a sign of inferior
quality, as we westerners generally laughed at any product that had the sign
"made in Japan"  and we now are suspect when a product says "made in China".
Old habits never die. or so it seems. The alleged quality differences
between German and Canadian lenses. between Wetzlar and Solms M bodies,
between Solms and Portugal R bodies, between German and Japanese
manufactured lenses only serve one purpose: produce smoke screens to make
the consumer insecure!


Erwin