Re: [Leica] PAW -- Criticism or Stroking?

["Jeffrey Fass" <happy.eyeball@verizon.net>]

Yes. What he said.

Jeffrey

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Nathan Wajsman" <wajsman@webshuttle.ch>
To: <leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us>
Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 12:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Leica] PAW -- Criticism or Stroking?


> Ellis,
>
> The purpose the PAW is to improve our photography collectively and so
> constructive criticism is definitely encouraged. I personally look at
> almost all PAWs, and typically my reaction is one of the following:
>
> 1) I love the picture but have nothing constructive to say except WOW.
> In that case I usually send the "WOW" to the poster privately since such
> praise does not contribute to the discussion on the list.
>
> 2) I see something interesting in the picture and have something
> constructive to say, such as a suggestion for improvement. In that case
> I make the critique on-list.
>
> 3) I find the picture utterly worthless and the only thing I can say
> about it is that it sucks. In those cases I just keep silent.
>
> All of the above of course assumes that I actually have the time to post
> feedback, whether privately or on the list. So if I do not react to
> someone's PAW, it does not necessarily mean that it is in category 3
above.
>
> Why the inconsistency between (1) and (3)? Because human nature is what
> it is and I like being nice to people better than telling them that
> their work stinks. I suspect most of us are that way.
>
> In summary, I think that we do need constructive critique, going after
> the ball, not the (wo)man.
>
> Finally, I would encourage you to start posting PAWs, the reaction you
> get from the LUG may teach you something and help you improve. That
> certainly has happened to me, and judging by what I see, to many others.
>
> Nathan
>
> Wariowilly@aol.com wrote:
>  > I'm new to posting, having been a "lurker" for quite awhile due to my
>  > fear of weighing in on various issues and being torn apart (however
>  > well intentioned) by far more knowledgeable members of LUG. But there
>  > seems to be a lack of, shall we say, intensity with respect to review
>  > and comment on PAWs. I'll be blunt -- I've seen a large number of
>  > PAWs that are, at best, mediocre, almost snapshots at a backyard
>  > barbeque that could have been taken with a $70 point and shoot
>  > camera. Yet, the comments for such works include things like "great
>  > shot" or "wonderful image." Even allowing for differences in taste,
>  > the feedback on the PAWs seems remarkably consistent, and
>  > overwhelmingly positive. Sure, its nice to encourage folks, and it
>  > isn't easy to submit anything for public scrutiny, especially by the
>  > extremely talented and knowledgeable people who contribute to this
>  > group on a regular basis. I wouldn't submit my work because, quite
>  > frankly, I don't think it is yet at a level where it should be shown,
>  > nay, inflicted on the general public, let alone the experts here.
>  >
>  > Don't get me wrong, lots of PAWs are amazing -- almost life
>  > transforming -- but others, well, its almost like "point a Leica at
>  > it and submit it." Should we all bite our tongues at the latter sort
>  > and keep silent, or offer encouraging "strokes," or should we be
>  > honest (but always respectful) and honestly present constructive
>  > criticism? Again, I don't want to belittle those who have the courage
>  > and confidence to submit PAWs, but I need clarification -- are we
>  > here to review and critique in constructive fashion, or simply to
>  > validate with hollow "attaboys"  yet another submission of someone's
>  > wife or daughter by the pool, or colorful locals sitting around a
>  > cafe in some foreign locale? I don't want to offend anybody, I'm just
>  >  wondering what the ground rules are.
>  >
>  > Many thanks to all for the wisdom the have provided, and continue to
>  > provide on this site.
>  >
>  > Ellis Krane -- To unsubscribe, see
>  > http://mejac.palo-alto.ca.us/leica-users/unsub.html
>  >
>  >
>
>
> --
> Nathan Wajsman
> Herrliberg (ZH), Switzerland
>
> e-mail: wajsman@webshuttle.ch
> mobile: +41 78 732 1430
>
> Photo-A-Week: http://www.wajsman.com/indexpaw2002.htm
> General photo site: http://www.wajsman.com/index.htm
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, see http://mejac.palo-alto.ca.us/leica-users/unsub.html

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