[Leica] Erwin reviews new Summilux

[mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner)]

This is the post you are responding too.


> These super lenes by Leica to be used at a fraction of a fraction of its
> capabilities on an M8 with a 1.33 crop factor its enough but not quite 
> enough
> to get someone to shoot film.
> 
> Leica could make some killer DX lenes for the M8.
> Incredibly sharp compact glass designed for the 1.33 crop circle factor.
> Film shooters are getting to be the tip of the iceberg of a niche.
> 
> A niche niche.
> 
> 
> Mark William Rabiner


Mark William Rabiner



> From: Geoff Hopkinson <hopsternew@gmail.com>
> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug@leica-users.org>
> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 10:50:38 +1000
> To: Leica Users Group <lug@leica-users.org>
> Subject: Re: [Leica] Erwin reviews new Summilux
> 
> Sunday morning coffee time here, Mark!
> Your thread was my contribution for the day on rebutting critiques of
> Leica..
> You are very welcome to disagree of course, thoughtful discussion is always
> educational. Just tell us the rationale behind each pont then.
>  Why do you categorically disagree strongly with every point? Can you 
> expand
> that beyond yes, yes, yes?
> No, no, no format was meant to be light hearted, see the smiley.
> 
> My views revisited are that Leica does not want to compete with the Cosina
> Voigtlander range and price point for example.
> Leica does not want to produce M lenses that are not suitable for every M
> camera in production now, the past and possibly the future.
> 
> I agree with your preference for compact modest aperture lens with great
> handling. I voted with my wallet by waiting 3 months and spending hundreds
> of dollars more for my new Elmar M 24 over the Elmarit M 24 (usually very
> much more expensive here). I also relish and use though, my fast Leica 
> glass
> wide open. No one does it better wide open than Leica.
> Regarding the M8 not being able to exploit the quality of the lenses, as 
> far
> as I know you haven't personally used the M8? I've only had mine for about
> 11 months now but have shot 5000 frames. Honestly they are capable of 
> superb
> output. My own criteria is printing here up to 12 inches by 18 inches.
> Putting a print from the same lenses on my M7 beside one from the M8 is a
> very rewarding experience.
> Do you think that the Summarits are not small enough for what you had in
> mind? Or still too expensive? How about the Elmarit 28 ASPH.?
> 
> All the real DX format lenses I see (Nikkors) are very much bulkier.
> Naturally zooms are a part of that. Did you note that now Nikon have a
> quandary because they have new full 35mm sensor size dSLRs and all of the 
> DX
> glass cripples those cameras? I can't imagine a pro with an expensive
> collection of Nikkors being pleased with that. Do you doubt that the Nikon
> and Canon ranges will keep moving to the larger sensor size? Sorry to
> mention the four thirds lenses, I know that you are very fond of them ;-)
> ;-) ;-), but although designed to be used with a smaller sensor area they
> are not my idea of compact largely. There is more to the designs than just
> the size of the image circle as you know.
> 
> Surely one of Leica's optical design strengths is how they do manage to
> package amazing performance into very compact form factors already. The 
> very
> best example of that I can think of is the Summicron M 28 ASPH. I guess the
> Elmarit M 28 ASPH. takes that further? It is much easier to design higher
> performance lenses if you are prepared to accept a bigger form factor.
> I just read your new post as I was typing. To the best of my knowledge it
> would be grossly impractical and expensive to produce a curved sensor as 
> you
> have suggested! Maybe you were referring to the angled micro-lenses
> overlaying the photosites?
> I think that the new sensor technology and image processor of the S2 will 
> be
> the basis of future R& M sensors.There you go, fire away, ready to repel
> boarders here ;-)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2009/2/1 Mark Rabiner <mark@rabinergroup.com>
> 
>> Wow Geoff! you are poised at your keyboard ready to pounce!
>> I categorically disagree strongly with everything you seem to have quickly
>> typed out here. Yes yes yes!
>> 
>> 
>> Mark William Rabiner
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> From: Geoff Hopkinson <hopsternew@gmail.com>
>>> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug@leica-users.org>
>>> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 07:29:33 +1000
>>> To: Leica Users Group <lug@leica-users.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [Leica] Erwin reviews new Summilux
>>> 
>>> No, no, no, no Mark.
>>> No because they already make a new range of extremely compact modest
>>> aperture lenses, the Summarits.
>>> Those are tiny, relatively cheaper and have nearly all of the performance
>> of
>>> the other modern designs but still covering your full 35mm crop circle.
>>> No because the M8 sensor capturea a stunning amount of information from
>>> their best glass already.
>>> No because the resolution of the M8 sensor is already appropriate if you
>>> want to go mathematical and calculate crop circles of confusion.
>>> No because any 'DX' lens would be useless on the film Ms that Leica still
>>> makes.
>>> No because any 'DX' lens would  be useless on any future 35mm sensor M
>>> camera.
>>> 
>>> The extra capability mentioned with the Elmar 24 for example is the
>>> performance in the outer field which is not recorded by the M8 'crop
>> circle'
>>> Performance in the extrem corners is pretty academic.
>>> 
>>> Did I mention no? ;-)
>>> 
>>> 2009/1/31 Mark Rabiner <mark@rabinergroup.com>
>>> 
>>>> These super lenes by Leica to be used at a fraction of a fraction of its
>>>> capabilities on an M8 with a 1.33 crop factor its enough but not quite
>>>> enough to get someone to shoot film.
>>>> 
>>>> Leica could make some killer DX lenes for the M8.
>>>> Incredibly sharp compact glass designed for the 1.33 crop circle factor.
>>>> Film shooters are getting to be the tip of the iceberg of a niche.
>>>> 
>>>> A niche niche.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Mark William Rabiner
>> 
>> --
>> Cheers
>> Geoff
>> Weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>> 
> 
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