Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2001/01/24

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Y2 Filter humbug!
From: "Dante A. Stella" <dante@umich.edu>
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:33:39 -0500
References: <001501c08613$577bb6c0$d1541b3f@oemcomputer> <3A6F5082.1A8B3C85@primus.com.au> <3A6F5863.69ED31E2@rabiner.cncoffice.com>

I read through this thread, and I think some of the things I have  been seeing are a
little strange.  The K2 yellow (Y2, medium yellow, etc), is a filter I have found very
close to useless with the Tmax line and not that useful for TX.

I would suggest bypassing anything medium yellow and going right for a #15, K3, Y52 or
even modern G or 056.  This gives two stops of reduction.

Some mistakes people are making include (1) giving exposure compensation and (2) not
using the right film.

As to (1), the whole point is that you are *cutting out* light.  For example,
limestone building against blue sky.  Both will show up as a light gray on paper.
Ugly.  Slap on a blue-cut filter and you have cut the sky down 2 stop and the building
maybe 1.  But if you give it two stops compensation, you will end up bringing back the
blue and shouldering out the building.  This effectively destroys your efforts  What
you really need to be doing is compensating *less* - like maybe one stop where the
filter says you are "supposed to" give 2.  Your average clouds on blue sky are already
bright enough to take the 2-stop hit.  And so what if you take a stop from the
shadows.  That's not where the action is.

As to (2), TX unqualifiedly sucks at highlight separation.  It has a very sudden
shoulder and a big bulge in the midtones.  In fact, in 35mm it is not so hot in
separating midtones, either.  If you are so inclined I can discuss tons of pictures I
have taken on it, where midtones have not separated well, even in N+2 and N-2
processing.

If you want grey, and not white, skies, use Plus-X or its 120 cousin, Verichrome Pan.
These two have extraordinary highlight separation.  Because Kodak up-rated their
speed, and increased development times since they were invented (if I recall, they
were originally 50/64, not 125), you will get better skies (since allegedly "normal"
processing is in fact a 1-stop push.

Which brings me to my next point - that the only real way to control and separate
highlights (like skies) is to do N+1 or N+2 processing.  But wait, you say -- that
will kill my shadows!  Wrong -- only if you don't know how to print these.  You just
drop the paper contrast (which only increases tonality in the shadows - the number of
distinct tones in the highlights is always the  same, no matter what the MC grade -
this is actually fascinating).

How do I know this?  I just got back from a trip in which I shot 24 rolls of TX, all
at N+2, nearly all with G filter (this is the modern, orange iteration), never giving
more than 1 stop of compensation, with nary a shadow problem.  This is a follow-on to
three trips in which I did the same thing.   Worse, I've even done it by mistaking TXP
for TX and shooting the same way.  No problems.

The 060 is a false prophet.  Good for darkening lips and ok at foliage, but completely
useless for skies.  Does not cut blue well because it contains blue.  Maybe its appeal
is that it tends to make pan film look like ortho.  Who knows.

Replies: Reply from Mark Rabiner <mark@rabiner.cncoffice.com> (Re: [Leica] Y2 Filter humbug!)
In reply to: Message from "Wilber Jeffcoat" <wilber@jeffcoatphotography.com> ([Leica] Y2 Filter)
Message from "A.H.SCHMIDT" <horsts@primus.com.au> (Re: [Leica] Y2 Filter)
Message from Mark Rabiner <mark@rabiner.cncoffice.com> (Re: [Leica] Y2 Filter)