Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2004/09/10

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Subject: [Leica] OT - HP 7960 Ink Longevity vs. Original Peizo
From: dorysrus at mindspring.com (Don Dory)
Date: Fri Sep 10 06:33:42 2004

As a follow up, I printed a group shot of the production staff of a
neighborhood restaurant four years ago on an Epson 1270.  The staff put
the print in a print sleeve and thumbtacked the whole to a wood support
by the service counter.  From 6:00am to 5:00pm daily the print is
exposed to strong IR from heat lamps, temperatures in excess of 100F,
steam off the chicken soup kept several feet away, and vapors from
thousands of meals sent over the counter.  The print has lost some of
it's Dmax, the skin tones have shifted 5-10cc's yellow green.  On the
whole, the print has held up better than some Fuji Crystal Archive
prints in similar conditions.

I would say that Epson's domination of the fine art market is probably
deserved from a longevity standpoint based on my results observing
prints that I have made hung in very hostile environments.

Don
dorysrus@mindspring.com

-----Original Message-----
From: lug-bounces+dorysrus=mindspring.com@leica-users.org
[mailto:lug-bounces+dorysrus=mindspring.com@leica-users.org] On Behalf
Of Ben Marks
Sent: Friday, September 10, 2004 8:06 AM
To: lug@leica-users.org
Subject: [Leica] OT - HP 7960 Ink Longevity vs. Original Peizo

Benjamin Marks here with some permanance testing data-points. Although
this is off-topic, I know that some of you (Tina, at least) print using
Jon Cone's Peizo inks.  There has also been some recent excitement over
HP's 7960 black and gray cartridges and the B&W print quality from that
family of printers

 On 1/5/04 I printed some test pictures on a friend's 7960 and cut the
prints in half. Incidentally, the initial quality of the three test
images that I printed was fabulous right out of the box (or rather,
right off the CD ROM [no manipulation required], which I provided to the
printer's owner). I do mean jaw-dropping.  One half was taped up in a
West-facing window (facing out), the other was put in a metal file
cabinet away from the light. Prints were on HP's paper which is one from
the top of the line (not the super premium heavy-weight stuff). As a
control print I printed the same picture on Ilford's Galerie matte
single-weight paper with Jon Cone's Peizo inks (first generation, the
Sundance inks, I think). Today is September 6, 2004 so this is a
nine-month report and given the results, I don't think that it makes
sense to continue with the test. 

Both inkjet prints in the window showed noticable fading compared to
their control-halves. The HP inkjet print faded to a warm reddish brown.
The paper base yellowed considerably and the print shows noticable
bleaching and loss of contrast when compared to the control print. The
HP ink on this print also has a blotchy or mottled quality. The HP
control print still shows excellent tonal separation and contrast.
Blacks are still blue-to-neutral and the overall print quality is good. 

The Peizo print also showed fading compared to its control half, with
the window print warming to a brown which I would compare to a
brown-toned or platinum print. This is similar to the stabilized tone of
Peizo prints which I have around the house framed under glass. The
Ilford paper base showed some warming, although not as much as the HP
paper. To give you a sense of how strong the sun is in a central Vermont
west-facing window, I had jotted some notes on the face of the Peizo
print with a water-based Pilot "Precise" roller-ball pen. Those comments
have almost entirely faded and must be read by tilting the paper to an
angle to read the impression that the pen made on the paper's surface. 

In the final analysis, this may have been too harsh a test to yield any
useful results. I did not have a traditional silver print as a further
control or a C-print from a one hour lab. The direct light in the window
was strong enough that the only lesson to be taken away from this is
"don't hang your inkjet prints facing outward against the windows."
Well, whoopie. No one does that anyway and the treatment that I
subjected both of these prints to is harsher than any I would subject a
traditional silver print to. The good news is that the environmental
contaminants in my home did not, by themselves, cause noticeable
degredation in either the HP print or the Peizo print when kept under
subdued light conditions. Another control print taped to the wall or
under glass and normal display conditions would have yielded more
practical results, I think. The head-to-head lesson in this test is the
edge in image permanance goes to the original Peizo carbon pigment
inkset over HP's inks !
 for the 7960. 

My own recommendation is that anyone using either of these printers give
careful thought to display and storage conditions of their prints.
Displaying prints in an environment with a lot of direct or reflected
window light is likely to lead to some print fading, with either inkset
regardless of the most optimistic claims put forward by an ink
manufacturer. 

Anyone with questions or comments may e-mail me at: 

Benjamin-Marks-at-verizon-dot-net (no dashes at all when you type it all
out) 

Best regards, 

Ben 

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In reply to: Message from benjaminmarks at verizon.net (Ben Marks) ([Leica] OT - HP 7960 Ink Longevity vs. Original Peizo)