Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2004/03/01

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Buyer beware: follow up open letter
From: Allen Graves <ahgraves@prodigy.net>
Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:58:51 -0600
References: <000001c3fff7$8ea8d4a0$880fe640@corp.nortel.com> <4043F947.9B775FF3@pacbell.net>

Jerry

I keep all my "for sale" emails as a quick reference for prices. The 
poster is a VERY regular poster to this group. This whole sordid mess 
makes eBay look good if it is true. A quick search of the archives 
for the serial # should lead you to the seller. I am impressed by 
Mark's integrity to this point. I have never had problems of any kind 
with a seller on this group. I hope this can all be resolved in a 
satisfactory manner. I think that Mark has been really understanding 
so far. A lot of us would have been out back sighting in the .45.

That as yet may be appropriate. [smiley]

Allen
>Vick
>
>If you read his two notes to the seller, you would see that eBay was
>not involved at all.  He bought it on the LUG, from one of us.
>
>He cannot involve the police, because he would have to divulge the
>sellers name.  Shock! Horror!
>
>Have you never bought anything from a member of the LUG?
>
>Jerry
>
>Vick Ko wrote:
>
>>  Mark, I am concerned that you are having this much difficulty with this
>>  matter.  I take risks buying on ebay, but I (so far) absolutely trust
>>  the LUG members if I were ever to buy from one.
>>
>>  Have you taken this up with the police in the city that the person lives
>>  in?
>>
>>  If this was a fraudulent sale, perhaps you can have the legal
>>  authorities help.
>>
>>  By the way, I am curious to know what items are on the camera that
>>  indicate that it is not an original black M3.  Is it possible for you to
>>  share that with us?
>>
>>  Good luck with this.
>>
>>  regards,
>>  Vick
>>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
>>  [mailto:owner-leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us] On Behalf Of Mark
>>  Theken
>>  Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:12 PM
>>  To: leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
>>  Cc: derleicaman@yahoo.com
>>  Subject: [Leica] Buyer beware: follow up open letter
>>
>>  Dear Xxxxxxx:
>>  It is disappointing that I have not received any
>>  response from you following my numerous attempts to
>>  bring resolution to my request for a refund for our
>>  recent transaction.  Even my request for a sales
>>  receipt has not been acknowledged by you.
>>  My email message to you this morning was returned
>>  undelivered.  It is very difficult to understand why
>>  an honest person acting in good faith would suddenly
>>  close an email account and effectively eliminate that
>>  avenue for communication.  The only remaining option
>>  is to once again use the LUG as a bulletin board to
>>  send a message you.
>>  As you know, I contacted you within 24 hours of
>>  receiving the camera and expressed my concern that the condition of the
>>  camera was possibly not original and as represented.  You offered
>>  several explanations in your email message to me that followed.  Based
>>  upon your long term association and reputation with the LUG, I requested
>>  that you provide documentation of the independent verification you cited
>>  in your earlier email message to me.
>>  In the delayed email message that followed,
>>  <<from your message:  "Sorry for the long delay in
>>  responding. I had several significant computer
>>  problems since Sunday">>
>>  you admitted that you had nothing in writing and the
>>  only verification of authenticity was in a past
>>  telephone conversation with an unnamed person.  After
>>  being delayed for several days due to your computer
>>  problems, I began my attempt to seek independent
>>  confirmation of the information you published in your
>>  original LUG post which follows:
>>  <<"Black Leica M3 #993xxx,
>>  guaranteed Wetzlar factory paint, $$$$
>>  Please contact me directly for price and details.
>>  Serious inquiries only".>>
>>  At my request, 3 expert collectors and dealers
>>  examined this camera alongside 2 known original black
>>  paint M3 cameras and verified my suspicion that the M3
>>  camera I purchased from you was not a original factory production camera
>>  as described in your FS listing.
>>  They also indicated that the differences would be
>>  difficult to ascertain by even the most knowledgeable
>  > Leica experts.
>>  It is my feeling that you made an unfortunate error in
>>  your LUG FS listing.  I also my feeling it is in your
>>  best interest to resolve the problem that resulted
>>  immediately.  Members of both the LUG and the LHSA
>>  have offered to intercede on your behalf.  I am
>>  hopeful you will choose to resolve this matter in a
>>  way that any member of the Leica community would
>>  expect of you.
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Mark Theken
>>
>>  __________________________________
>>  Do you Yahoo!?
>>  Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail.
>>  http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools
>>  --
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>>
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>
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In reply to: Message from "Vick Ko" <vick.ko@sympatico.ca> (RE: [Leica] Buyer beware: follow up open letter)
Message from Jerry Lehrer <jerryleh@pacbell.net> (Re: [Leica] Buyer beware: follow up open letter)