Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2012/06/17

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Subject: [Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re: How about this one?
From: mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 14:40:08 -0400

Now that I've read the Wiki carefully from front to back I see it was far
from Joe Rosenthal doing it again; as he didn't do it the first time nor was
there. Its far more interesting story than I thought it to be.

- - from my iRabs.
Mark Rabiner
http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/springdays/


> From: Mark William Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com>
> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
> Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 04:15:04 -0400
> To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
> Subject: Re: [Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re: How about this one?
> 
> I think the crux  of the issue is do street shooters interact with their
> subjects or are they ciphers who blend into the wall paper and never say a
> word and I think its mainly the former.
> If it turned out the puddle jump was the fifth take it would not ruin it 
> for
> me as the truth of the moment goes. It has the puddle jumpers idea to make
> the jump in the first place it would be no big deal to me for him to do it
> again to make sure the photographer got the shot.
> Which was the exact thing which happened in the Raising the Flag on Iwo 
> Jima
> shot by Joe Rosenthal. First it really happened. Then Joe Rosenthal had 
> them
> redo it. Maybe he left his lens cap on the first time. But nobody cares. I
> don't. Threes enough "truth" in it for me and everybody.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_the_Flag_on_Iwo_Jima
> 
> - - from my iRabs.
> Mark Rabiner
> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/springdays/
> 
> 
>> From: Richard Man <richard at richardmanphoto.com>
>> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>> Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 01:06:24 -0700
>> To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re: How about this one?
>> 
>> Monsieur Cartier-Bresson obviously loved to play head games with his fan.
>> He clearly said a few times that he couldn't see too well through the slot
>> or hole in the fence, but he never said, AFAIK, whether he got the guy to
>> jump multiple times or not. He deliberately left it vague.
>> 
>> It would be great as an intellectual resolution to know the answer once 
>> and
>> for all.
>> 
>> thanks
>> 
>> On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 12:51 AM, Mark Rabiner <mark at 
>> rabinergroup.com>wrote:
>> 
>>> I was afraid of that.  I went flipping though the book when I was in
>>> Portland last month and I never found the page. The show we saw in NY
>>> though
>>> was not that show you are mentioning. It was the Scrapbook show. Early
>>> work.
>>> It could be I dreamt the contact sheet of puddle jumping but I was not
>>> aware
>>> I was that delusional.  Possible though. The place I would have seen it
>>> would have been in the International Center of Photography five years 
>>> ago.
>>> Perhaps someone who was with me from the NYLUG can corroborate it.
>>> I certainly can not find it in numerous searches on Bing and Google
>>> contacts
>>> sheet mode searches.
>>> Henri Cartier-Bresson's Scrapbook: Photographs, 1932?1946
>>> JANUARY 19?APRIL 29, 2007
>>> http://www.icp.org/museum/exhibitions/henri-cartier-bressons-scrapbook
>>> 
>>> - - from my iRabs.
>>> Mark Rabiner
>>> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/springdays/
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> From: Richard Man <richard at richardmanphoto.com>
>>>> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>>>> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2012 18:37:02 -0700
>>>> To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>>>> Subject: [Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re:  How about this one?
>>>> 
>>>> Mark, I checked my copy of "Celebrating the Negative," and the negative
>>>> shown is just that single frame, cut off, without sprocket holes on on
>>> edge
>>>> even (Henri "ate them," so he said).
>>>> 
>>>> No there is no contact sheet of the sequence. Unfortunately, it's not
>>>> included in the Magnum book "Contact Sheet" either.
>>>> 
>>>> I went to the "Modern Century" show of HCB's photos a few years ago in
>>>> SFMOMA and there's no such contact sheet :-(
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Sat, Jun 9, 2012 at 10:15 PM, Mark Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> In the contact sheet in the book  "Celebrating the Negative"  by
>>>>> John Loengard you can see he is caught in the air jumping over the same
>>>>> puddle from the same spot at least 27 times.
>>>>> Some of us NY LUG guys also saw and discused that contact sheet when it
>>> was
>>>>> displayed in the early HCB show at the ICP in new York a few years ago:
>>>>> Henri Cartier-Bresson's Scrapbook: Photographs, 1932?1946
>>>>> JANUARY 19?APRIL 29, 2007
>>>>> 
>>>>> Derriere la Gare Saint-Lazare  better known as:
>>>>> The Puddle Jumper
>>>>> 
>>>>> This photo findable now on the internet is mainly used as an example 
>>>>> for
>>>>> the
>>>>> other myth. That HCB (or other Magnum shooters) never cropped. This
>>> photo
>>>>> is
>>>>> cropped by quite a bit. As are a handful of others of his.
>>>>> They are saying in many examples I find on the internet  that he is
>>>>> shooting
>>>>> through a fence which reinforces the whole "decisive moment" myth;
>>> Waiting
>>>>> patiently some magic moment to happen from a hole in a fence clicking
>>> once
>>>>> and going home.
>>>>> But the guy jumps from the same place over the same puddle strip after
>>>>> strip.
>>>>> And there was no reason for HCB to not act like any other magazine
>>>>> photographer of the time and perhaps a bit less so, now.. To be heavily
>>>>> involved with what he was shooting.
>>>>> Of course its always depended on the exact kind of thing you're
>>> shooting.
>>>>> Baby shoes and so on. Hiring models to kiss in front of crowds of
>>> leering
>>>>> men...
>>>>> 
>>>>> - - from my iRabs.
>>>>> Mark Rabiner
>>>>> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/springdays/
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> From: Richard Man <richard at richardmanphoto.com>
>>>>>> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>>>>>> Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2012 17:52:29 -0700
>>>>>> To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Leica] How about this one?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In the "Impassionated Eye" video, HCB explicitly said the same thing
>>> you
>>>>>> did, so I think the "asking the guy jumping multiple times" is a myth.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> and I just love this video
>>>>>> http://vimeo.com/33376713
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 9, 2012 at 5:17 PM, B. D. Colen <bd at bdcolenphoto.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Finally, I won't put money on this - but I don't think HCB had the 
>>>>>>> guy
>>>>> do
>>>>>>> anything. He was shooting through a hole in a fence, and shot a 
>>>>>>> series
>>>>> of
>>>>>>> people as they tried to get across the puddle. The best of the images
>>> he
>>>>>>> got was of the famous jumper. At least I believe that's correct.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com>
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com>
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information




Replies: Reply from photo.forrest at earthlink.net (Phil Forrest) ([Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re: How about this one?)
In reply to: Message from mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner) ([Leica] "The Puddle Jumper" / Re: How about this one?)