Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2013/05/27

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Subject: [Leica] PESO: RG Lewis and Leica M frustrations
From: mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner)
Date: Mon, 27 May 2013 04:26:35 -0400

Before a Leica M6 was thought to be a high priced rarified item but Leica
was getting a grand for it same as Nikon and Canon were getting for their
flagship cameras but Nikon and canon was making 100 times more of them. And
probably getting a higher return on each one.
So Leica hung on by a thread.
Kaufman when he bought the company and with his experienced perspective on
the market. knew that if Leica was going to make a premium product in small
amounts he was going to have to really change a premium price for it.
And Not change the same and call it premium because I was low tech for the
same money.
So that's what he did.
And it worked.
Leica is in the black. And its heading in a good direction.
I feel strongly by the end of next year it will be seen in an entirely
different light than it is now.


On 5/27/13 4:17 AM, "Mark Rabiner" <mark at rabinergroup.com> wrote:

> A problem with our opinions of the higher Leica pricing what that seven
> grand usd has got us.  It got us an M8 or M9 which was not embraced but the
> top people who'd been shooting before with M6's. Most of those went on to
> shoot DSLR's. So it got  us gear which was of limited success.
> So for the most part digital Leica has been practiced by rich guys we'd
> never heard of;  and whose results we're never going to see. If they
> actually used the cameras to any effect. Present company of course 
> excepted.
> 
> I think at least now finally for our seven grand we're going to be in 
> better
> company. We'll be in the company of top people who spent the money on this
> rarified stuff, the M240 and Monochrome and then went out and did notable
> work with it. Like before with our M6,7,and P's. Work we're now seeing in
> top magazines, newspapers and catalogs.
> And that will make us feel better about the percentage of our body of 
> wealth
> that we've put into this gear.
> And of course we'll be able to see the results we're getting with this gear
> ourselves.
> 
> Nobodies going to be calling it jewelry.
> The collective body of work done with the new digital bodies will be a
> matter of public record.
> 
> 
> On 5/27/13 3:41 AM, "Frank Dernie" <Frank.Dernie at btinternet.com> wrote:
> 
>> Spot on Mark. The idea that Leica has -suddenly- become a "boutique" 
>> brand,
>> labelled thus to insult it, is wrong. Lots of people have believed that 
>> for
>> decades, and lots of users have always felt the results justified the 
>> price.
>> 
>> Personally, I think the prices, here in the UK,  are reasonable for the 
>> small
>> production volume and high quality.
>> It seems they can charge far more in certain aspirational and growing 
>> markets
>> so it makes sound business sense to supply them first, both from a market
>> growth and a margin perspective.
>> In Europe there is a dwindling market, not least due to a steady decline 
>> in
>> prosperity (which I see no sign of changing, personally).
>> In the USA people are very price sensitive - suppliers generally sell at 
>> the
>> lowest prices in the USA to get business. I haven't looked lately but I 
>> was
>> certainly surprised to see that a Porsche was cheaper in California than
>> Stuttgart and a Nikon cheaper in New York than Tokyo.
>> Why wouldn't Leica supply their most enthusiastic market first and the
>> wingeing cheapskates later ;-)
>> 
>>> From a personal perspective I have been disappointed not to get my M yet,
>>> particularly when I got my hopes up when Henning received his.
>> 
>> I have been dithering about cancelling my order simply because the M9 is
>> fantastic, and the extra features of the M may well be adequately served 
>> for
>> my purposes by the Fuji X-Pro1.
>> OTOH despite much considering doing so, and being disappointed, I haven't
>> actually gone as far as to cancel the order yet...
>> FD
>> 
>> 
>> On 27 May, 2013, at 06:41, Mark Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> When thing we know we're going to get from a new camera from Leica.
>>> Its going to cost a lot more than we'd prefer it to cost.
>>> That really goes without saying.
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> 
> 
> 




-- 
Mark William Rabiner
Photography
http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/




Replies: Reply from Frank.Dernie at btinternet.com (Frank Dernie) ([Leica] PESO: RG Lewis and Leica M frustrations)
In reply to: Message from mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner) ([Leica] PESO: RG Lewis and Leica M frustrations)